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2002 Altima 2.5L P0420 Code. Attn: Tech and MPE Forums > > 2002 Altima 2.5L P0420 Code. Attn: Tech and MPE 2002 Altima 2.5L P0420 Code. Attn: Tech and MPE
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  #1  
Old 01-08-2012, 07:43 PM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default 2002 Altima 2.5L P0420 Code. Attn: Tech and MPE

Howdy guys...long time no "chat" ;).

This Altima has this code according to my scanner. I was reading some posts that the first place to start with this is a reprogram of the ECM. How do I know that this particular vehicle needs the reprogram? Is there any way either of you can check a VIN if I supplied and tell me if it should have been reprogrammed?

Was this ever a recall/free to do item? No paperwork was ever received from Nissan to do anything on this, and the car is owned by the original owner.

Thanks for any information or further detail you can provide. I can supply the VIN # if needed, just tell me how to get it to you.

Much appreciated!
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  #2  
Old 01-09-2012, 02:14 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default A Recall and TSB on P0420

Ah, I knew it :). Here's a recall and a TSB on this code and problem. The full TSB and recall are too large to post, but here is the dealer letter. The VIN # range covers this particular vehicle as well (it's in the first group on the chart on the TSB) Any opinions? Thanks.
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File Type: pdf 2002 Altima Catalytic Converter Recall.pdf (58.6 KB, 28 views)
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  #3  
Old 01-09-2012, 02:56 AM
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mpe235 mpe235 is offline
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There is no way to tell by the vin if the car has the latest program. You need to use a scan tool to read the ecm ID to see which one it has.
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  #4  
Old 01-09-2012, 05:05 AM
DCARLTON DCARLTON is offline
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If Nissan repair records were kept correctly and the recall work had been performed, Nissan should be able to tell you by VIN that the recall was done for you specific vehicle. Yes, there are a lot of if's in there but I believe they are or should be required by law to not only attempt to notify the owner of recall work but also note when the recall work was done.
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  #5  
Old 01-09-2012, 01:47 PM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default Thanks to MPE and Tech

Thanks guys. I'm going to contact Nissan and see what they tell me. This car by that bulletin and recall should be covered for this repair at no charge. The VIN of the car falls in the range and it describes the problem.

Should I write a letter to Nissan Corporate and explain this problem and ask for a warranty repair at no charge?

Thanks.

Last edited by Ponchoguy; 01-09-2012 at 02:02 PM.
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  #6  
Old 01-10-2012, 07:16 AM
DCARLTON DCARLTON is offline
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Read the TSB and read the recall notice very carefully. Nissan worded it carefully and specifically and while it does mention engine replacement, most people never get their engine replace for one of many reasons. Many 2002 Altima owners accused Nissan of making a disposable car that self destructed at 100,000 miles. We didn't find out about the issues surrounding this car until after my daughter purchased it. After having a Maxima with 200,000+ miles on it, I figured a car with 130,000 on it was just getting broke in. We walked on egg shells with this car as long as she owned it and after all was said and done, she replaced it with another Altima, albeit a 2012 model. The 2002 with 200,000 miles never exhibited any pre-cat issue, although I did replace it, Nissan did do the recall work on it, and the oil was changed religiously every 3000 miles as a way to keep check on what the car was doing.

The recalls specifically addresses specific issues. One was to address the issue of loose butterfly nuts that could fall off into the cylinder. These were to be re-tightened to spec to keep this from happening. The other recall was to check for catalyst failure and reprogram the computer; this reprogramming was to address the issue of timing when valves were open/closed with regards to exhaust and heat and sucking cat material back into the engine.

Even if the recall was/is done and the engine fails outside of the warranty, chances are you're not going to get an engine replacement on a car that is 10 years old with significant mileage Most of these failures occurred outside of any warranty, usually 100,000 miles or more.

I suspect, but don't know this for sure, any car that had the recall performed early in its life, most likely did not eat the catalyst and suck it back into the engine. There are still many of these cars on the road today, not all of them suffered catastrophic engine failure caused by the pre-cat.

Last edited by DCARLTON; 01-10-2012 at 07:24 AM.
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  #7  
Old 01-10-2012, 08:22 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default TSB and Recalls

All:

I called Nissan with the VIN # and they claim there are two open campaigns:

P5216 for the rear bushings/frame.
R0712 for the engine reprogram.

Both will be done at no charge at a local dealer, so that's good and those will be done.

I did baffle the rep when he stated that recall NTB03-070d was done on 12/19/03, yet the bulletin from Nissan is dated 2008 :). I'm going to read it again and call. I would assume the reprogram is going to clear the P0420. If it doesn't, then I will press the issue of the catalyst and so forth.

DCarlton: I've driven GM cars my whole life. Never needed major engine work, just regular TLC (which I've always done myself). I find this Altima to be very cheaply screwed together and poor overall quality, but it's a nice riding car, that much I will say about it. It's not too hard to work on and parts are fairly cheap for it. Since I do my own work, I'm big on cars that make sense when you have to repair/service them.

My 1993 Saturn cost a lot less than this car did AND I got antilock brakes and traction control (whereas this Altima did not come with that, some 9 model years later...)

Thanks and will keep all posted.
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  #8  
Old 01-10-2012, 08:49 AM
DCARLTON DCARLTON is offline
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The recall procedure will clear the P0420 by the fact that the re-program should reset the ECM and clear all codes. As part of the recall, as specified, they will check the catalyst and let you know of its condition. If it has failed, they will recommend replacement of the pre-cat. If it hasn't failed the P0420 most likely points to a O2 sensor that is not reporting back to the ECM correctly and it will be recommended to replace both O2 sensors. The recall will clear the code but it won't necessarily fix the underlying issue that caused the code to appear.

They may at their discretion, check the engine for damage if the pre-cat is determined to be bad.

Keep us posted as to what they decide to do; will be interesting to see if they follow the same path that most of us have been down in the past.
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  #9  
Old 01-10-2012, 10:27 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default P0420 and others

I will keep everyone informed. If the code/light returns, it's going back and I'm going to insist on it being repaired right under the recall.

If the sensors are bad, I'll change those, that's easy to do.
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  #10  
Old 01-11-2012, 07:47 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default Service Appt on Friday 1/13/12

The car goes in for these two recalls on Friday, so I'll let everyone know how it works out.

I'll gauge if the light stays off or not. If it doesn't, I'll go from there on it. The problem is that in 2003, the catalyst may have been deemed to have been "OK" and maybe it should have been replaced at that time. The previous dealer was problematic according to the owner, so who knows what was done....
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  #11  
Old 01-14-2012, 09:11 PM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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The dealer did the #P5216 suspension recall (including the two new stay arms that are required as this is a 2002 (and fairly early build) Altima. They also did the ECM reprogram.

They stated that they believe the light will come on again....I'm going to dig into this with Nissan a bit too.

Tech and MPE: Would your next step (if the light comes on again) be to replace the two O2 sensors? I can get NTK units for $80 for the pair, and I e-mailed NTK and they told me they were the OEM supplier to Nissan and that the NTK units through them in the aftermarket are identical to the dealer OEM uints.

Is it hard to change these two sensors? I'll have to have a look if the need arises, but any other info would be great.

Thanks again.

Last edited by Ponchoguy; 01-14-2012 at 09:23 PM. Reason: More Info.
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  #12  
Old 01-19-2012, 05:20 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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The light has returned.....as would be suspected.

I took a look at the diagnostic tree for the P0420 code. I don't know the age of those O2 sensors (they could be original and the car has about 135k on it), so I'm thinking a good start is to replace those two with two NTK units. NTK is the OEM supplier and the two parts they list are the same as the dealer units for a lot less money.

Any other comments or thoughts are welcomed. I'm also going to get on the phone with Nissan on this too and let them know of my plan.

I think it's bad business when they have a problem like this and they let it go for so long or tried to sweep it under the rug....
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  #13  
Old 01-19-2012, 06:36 AM
DCARLTON DCARLTON is offline
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Any O2 sensor with 100,000 + miles on it is overdue for replacement. A flaky O2 sensor may not trigger an O2 sensor error code, and may in fact trigger the SES light and then days later, turn it off. I had a bad O2 sensor on a Ford Taurus that never went completely bad but it would turn the light on and off throughout the weeks of driving as it would go in and out of spec. My daughter's 2002 Altima would do the same thing.

A good code scanner that can read the data stream can detect the different readings between the 2 sensors and could show why the 420 code appears. A difference in the readings between the O2 sensors will cause the 420 code to appear but the difference may be within spec for the O2 sensor and not enough to trigger the O2 sensor error; think of the 2 sensors as partners that are not quite on the same page.

Replacing them both at the same time will at least get them back on the same page and you can eliminate them from the equation. If the problem comes back after replacement, then you can accurately suspect the pre-cat as bad but I would believe that Nissan would have told you the pre-cat was bad (but you never know about those guys).

Let us know

Edit: I believe you can use either NTK or Bosch, but whatever you do, replace them both with the same brand.
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  #14  
Old 01-19-2012, 07:18 AM
Ponchoguy Ponchoguy is offline
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Default O2 Sensors

Thanks for your input, I'm probably going to go with the sensors only due to the fact that they are likely the originals and the car does have 135k on it. If nothing else, it might help the gas mileage a bit.....

As for the sensors, NTK is the original OEM. Bosch may be buying the NTK sensor and reboxing it. That happens a lot in the aftermarket, as I worked in the parts industry for 11 years and I saw it (and still do see it) all the time.

I'll check the Bosch prices out, but the NTK units seem to be the cheapest and if they are the originals in an NTK box, that's the way I'll go. Where you get into trouble is where there are aftermarket consolidations going on. They consolidate heater elements among other parameters.

That might work on a one wire GM O2 sensor of years past, but with OBD2 as we know, that's nothing to consolidate/play with.

Thanks again and I'll let you know. I'll also be in touch with Nissan shortly.....
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  #15  
Old 01-19-2012, 07:23 AM
DCARLTON DCARLTON is offline
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As long as you stick with one or the other, you will be okay. I found the NTK's at Advanced Auto to be the best price and if I remember correctly, given some lead time, you can get them off of Amazon for even less (and if you have a prime account, you may get them with Free Shipping and no tax making the deal even sweeter). I always go with the ones that have the original wiring harness and never the ones that are 'universal'
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