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andrewdavid 03-05-2011 01:55 PM

VQ40 Secondary Timing Chain Issues
 
I'm another victim for the tensioner shoe's premature failure.
2006 Pathfinder with 60,500 miles, Nissan is not willing to cover this under a goodwill warranty for being 500 miles over.

If this a known defect, why are they so arrogant and willing to loose a customer?

If I actually decide to pay them the $1675.00 they want to perform the repair, will it last???

Are the new parts improved?

NissanTech 03-05-2011 07:21 PM

Quote:

If I actually decide to pay them the $1675.00 they want to perform the repair, will it last??? Are the new parts improved?
Yes, the parts should last longer that the originals.

Did you tried calling 1-800-NISSAN-1? tell them that you are considering buying another Nissan and that your decision will be based on how much they are willing to help you with your current problem.

andrewdavid 03-05-2011 09:09 PM

Yes, I have called.
My file # is 7106220, Ryan ( My Regional Specialist) has stated that " Nissan Cannot help with this repair"
I asked to speak with someone else, he replied that the decision was made from a group of people, including himself and that the decision was final. He would not give me the name of his supervisor, but said someone would contact me within the next business day(which would be Monday 3/8)

I have owned 85' , 87' and 89' 300z's and my daily is a 97' Maxima. The Pathfinder is my wife's truck.

andrewdavid 03-07-2011 01:27 PM

We'll, I did get my call back from Nissan... Same response from Michelle " Nissan Cannot Help with this repair"

The parts I need to purchase from Nissan to fix their defect, will be the last dime that Nissan will see from me.

I guess Nissan makes enough cash from the parts and labor to fix their poor quality products, that customer retention is not a concern..

Dave1965 03-08-2011 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewdavid (Post 63894)
We'll, I did get my call back from Nissan... Same response from Michelle " Nissan Cannot Help with this repair"

The parts I need to purchase from Nissan to fix their defect, will be the last dime that Nissan will see from me.

I guess Nissan makes enough cash from the parts and labor to fix their poor quality products, that customer retention is not a concern..

It's theoretically possible that sometime in the future they will reimburse you. They have done so on the IPDM, fuel level sensor, and radiator/transmission issues in the past by extending warranties and providing reimbursement. Maybe the Timing Chain Issue will become "reimburseable" as well? Just be sure you have the work done at a Nissan Dealer and save your Repair Order/proof of payment.

I was just recently reimbursed for the IPDM fiasco that occured 2 years ago with my wife being stranded in South Carolina.

Go to www.nissanassist.com for examples of terms/conditions of what they've been doing on the aforementioned issues.

mdawg4x4 03-08-2011 05:24 AM

It just cost me $1806 to have mine replaced plus fix an oil leak that the dealer wasn't able to fix the 4 previous trips.

andrewdavid 03-08-2011 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave1965 (Post 63918)
It's theoretically possible that sometime in the future they will reimburse you. They have done so on the IPDM, fuel level sensor, and radiator/transmission issues in the past by extending warranties and providing reimbursement. Maybe the Timing Chain Issue will become "reimburseable" as well? Just be sure you have the work done at a Nissan Dealer and save your Repair Order/proof of payment.

I was just recently reimbursed for the IPDM fiasco that occured 2 years ago with my wife being stranded in South Carolina.

Go to www.nissanassist.com for examples of terms/conditions of what they've been doing on the aforementioned issues.

I really do not have too much faith in Nissan or the dealers at this point.
We purchase the new cars/trucks at the dealers, but when things go wrong our only choice is to call 1 800 nissan at talk to someone who is trained and encouraged to deny our claims.

I want someone with the authority to approve / deny warranty repairs to tell me face to face that a timing chain guide should fail at 60,500 miles and that even though I have proof of 15 oil changes , I should of had this truck dealer serviced and "this wouldn't have happened" or if it was dealer serviced, the warranty would have been approved"

What would the dealer have done to prevent this, that normal service practices would not?

I understand that "shit happens" in manufacturing and things don't always go as planned. I can forgive that. But what I cannot forgive is the failure to make an effort to correct the defect.

I would love to hear from anyone that took his/her pathfinder in for an oil change at 50,000 miles(While still under warranty), and the dealer volunteered that " we noticed a whinning noise coming from your engine, We'll take care of that at no charge"

I will not hand over $1700.00 to the dealer with the hope that someday Nissan will cover the cost. The problem is now, not 2 years in the future.

I welcome any comments, and appreciate any advice, but from my point of view this sucks!!

mdawg4x4 03-08-2011 06:13 PM

I agree with you completely. This is not a small occurance issue. But, I love my truck, it is almost paid off, I plan on keeping it for a long time, I wasn't willing to risk the engine itself, and other makes have their issues. Sometimes they stand behind them, sometimes they don't.

If I get some money back, good. If I don't, I should have another 70K miles before it due again.

Dave1965 03-09-2011 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdawg4x4 (Post 63957)
I agree with you completely. This is not a small occurance issue. But, I love my truck, it is almost paid off, I plan on keeping it for a long time, I wasn't willing to risk the engine itself, and other makes have their issues. Sometimes they stand behind them, sometimes they don't.

If I get some money back, good. If I don't, I should have another 70K miles before it due again.

Will most likely last more than 70K miles (fingers crossed/knock on wood/salt thrown over shoulder/chicken sacrificed under a full moon).

The "fix" for the timing chain issue from what I've gathered from other forums is that they re-shaped (smoothed out) the chain so that it doesn't have as much friction against the tensioner shoes. This was from folks comparing old parts with the new ones side by side. No hard evidence of whether the tensioner pads were redesigned with tougher material.

mdawg4x4 03-09-2011 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave1965 (Post 63962)
Will most likely last more than 70K miles (fingers crossed/knock on wood/salt thrown over shoulder/chicken sacrificed under a full moon).

I like your optimism!

andrewdavid 03-10-2011 01:12 PM

What happens if the secondary tensioner guides are not replaced???
Has anyone run the engine until the chain has failed?

I can just picture the chain running on the tensioner piston until it cuts it in half, bent valves, Busted timing case etc...

I have ordered the new parts and the flex plate lock tool. I was just wondering if anyone has had a chain fail and at what mileage

mdawg4x4 03-10-2011 03:59 PM

I don't recall anybody letting it go that far on a Frontier, but have heard, from dealers, of some Altimas needing engines due to chain failures. I guess Forum users and truck owners in general are smart enough to have work done when something doesn't sound right.

andrewdavid 03-10-2011 04:17 PM

I may not be the sharpest pencil in the desk, but I have learned a few things these past few weeks.

1. After purchasing a new vehicle, follow the forums to find the defects before the warranty expires.

2. Nissan is more concerned about their wallets than their reputation.

3. There are a great # of owners and tech's willing to offer their help and experiences.

4. When the parts come in, my ass is going to be opening up a a 60,000 mile nissan engine .

mdawg4x4 03-11-2011 05:01 AM

The only bad part about doing it yourself, if Nissan compensates later as they did with the fuel sending unit, you will not get refunded. I did my own fuel sending unit repair , but was only out $70 and a couple hrs of my time.

Dave1965 03-11-2011 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewdavid (Post 64023)
What happens if the secondary tensioner guides are not replaced???
Has anyone run the engine until the chain has failed?

To your first question:
If by "guides" you mean the shoes, aren't replaced, the chain starts running on the metal portion of the tensioner. You'll then have metal-on-metal contact that will wear on the chain as well as the shaft of the now "shoeless" tensioner. If enough slack prevails, I suppose the short (secondary) camshaft chain could jump off the sprocket resulting in catastrophic engine failure on that side of the motor. Of course, depending on how many metal bits shear off the valves and pistons and enter the engine oil supply, you might as well consider the entire engine "toast."

On your second question:
I dare say that if anyone runs their engine until the chain fails, they would be so disgusted/enraged with Nissan that they wouldn't fathom returning to this forum or any other venue containing the name "Nissan." Personally, I would be so traumatized that I'd probably deny ever owning one.

mark5s 03-11-2011 05:06 PM

yup, me too
 
So the dealer informed me that the intermittent (but more and more regular) whining noise I hear from my 2007 Pathfinder with 62,500 miles is the result of, you guessed it, the timing chain tensioner. That will be $2000 please. Really? Nice quality work Nissan. What a piece of crap. No choice but to fix it now however the car will be sold in about 50K more miles (if it lasts that long).

andrewdavid 03-11-2011 06:54 PM

Just just spent 3 hrs on club frontier forum, an older poll showed 25% of owners having this issue. And I'm sure that result is low, I doubt that poll is a true reflection because some people will just take it up the *ss quielty from the dealers and Nissan.

I would love to see a current poll of all vq35 and vq40 engine owners to to see what the failure rate is and at what mileage, re-occurence...

Nissan may not feel it now, but that is because we are stuck with what we have, unless we are willing to take a great loss to trade it in on another make.

Wait 4,5, 6.. years from now. They just lost 25% + of returning new car sales.

Unless Nissan does a quick 180 and takes care of this issue, I will never consider buying their products again. It's a real shame that my 2006 path, will cost more to repair in 5 years , than my 97' maxima in 12 years that I have owned it.

My advice, tell all friends, family and co workers, if you have one of these vehicles, get it fixed before the warranty runs out. That may buy you another 60k....

Quote from Nissan Literature in 2006
"Like others in the VQ series, the 4.0-liter version includes such advanced design features as Electronic Throttle Control with secondary mapping in 4LO (4x4 models), Continuous Valve Timing Control (C-VTC), Nissan variable Induction Control System (NICS), silent timing chain, microfinished camshaft and crankshaft surfaces, molybdenum-coated pistons, resin intake manifold, digital knock control system, high capacity muffler, lightweight aluminum block and platinum-tipped spark plugs."

Silent timing chain???? Really False advertising???

Maybe they should have tested the engine further than the rub-n-tug on the corner

mdawg4x4 03-12-2011 03:31 PM

I'm sure there are many more people without issues that did not participate in the pole, where as every truck with the timing chain issues voted.

andrewdavid 03-13-2011 03:36 PM

I see your point.
But also during the poll, some owners who first stated they didn't have the issue, later posted that it had happened to them at a later date.

mdawg4x4 03-13-2011 04:38 PM

That is true too. In time, many that said they didn't will.

nunu23 03-15-2011 05:26 AM

Timing Chain, Tensioner and Guides
 
I just had my secondary chains and tensioner shoes replaced. I have a 2008 Pathfinder. All covered by warranty. Did not pay a thing. It took a couple of days.

andrewdavid 03-15-2011 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nunu23 (Post 64192)
I just had my secondary chains and tensioner shoes replaced. I have a 2008 Pathfinder. All covered by warranty. Did not pay a thing. It took a couple of days.


What mileage is on the truck?
How did the dealer explain why the shoes wore out?

jaesonhunter 04-27-2011 06:08 PM

All this makes me feel REAL optimistic about my Xterra. I've got 105k on it, it's an 06...well outside warranty range. I didn't think much of that annoying noise at first, since it had been making it for so long. Thought it was just a normal VQ40 sound. But, as it's gotten louder, (I can hear it quite distinctly over my K&N intake and Flowmaster muffler) and learning how much it's costing everyone else to get it fixed...I thinking about just letting the bank have my rig! I'm paying $500 a month on the loan as it is, and only making $10 an hour! With gas going the way it is and the prices of everything else skyrocketing, an unexpected repair bill is the LAST thing I need when I'm barely making the payments for my X as it is.

Thanks Nissan, for designing as a piece of Scheisse "silent" timing chain! Maybe keeping it a belt like the 1st gen Xterra would have been better!

mark5s 04-28-2011 03:55 PM

fixed, maybe
 
So I fussed with my Nissan dealer (Tischer Nissan in MD) about why Nissan builds timing chain tensioners to fail at relatively low mileage for a timing chain (my 2007 Pathfinder has 63,182 miles). Botton line was on 22 March they replaced the secondary chains, tensioners and chain guide for basically free (the bill to me was $282.00t I asked then to put on a new serpentine belt when the put everything back together). Not sure how long this will last - will probably sell at 100k miles. Looking at the bill, all the charges for labor and parts are inthe "warranty" column.

mdawg4x4 04-28-2011 05:37 PM

mark5s, awesome news. Some dealerships do care about their customers. Even if you did have to argue a little. All the ones I deal with are nothing extra.

callahan98 04-18-2012 11:55 AM

Well lets see, my warranty expires 960 miles ago and now I have the same timming chain guide issue. I called the dealership and the guy was rude ans acted like $1300 was nothing and when did I want to make an appointment to get it done. I am not very happy about this and I live everything else about my truck, but now I have to fix it on my own dime. anyone know how to fix this any pics or instructions. Its a 2007 Frontier 4x4 4.0.
Thanks Tim

mdawg4x4 04-19-2012 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by callahan98 (Post 77866)
Well lets see, my warranty expires 960 miles ago and now I have the same timming chain guide issue. I called the dealership and the guy was rude ans acted like $1300 was nothing and when did I want to make an appointment to get it done. I am not very happy about this and I live everything else about my truck, but now I have to fix it on my own dime. anyone know how to fix this any pics or instructions. Its a 2007 Frontier 4x4 4.0.
Thanks Tim

Go to another dealer and call the 1-800-number in the back of your owners manual.

mark5s 04-21-2012 02:56 PM

The local dealer was not able to help me which was understandable but unacceptable. They suggested I call Nissan Consumer Affairs (1-800-647-7261) to begin a dialogue. The conversations with consumer affairs were very professional. I made my case, sent them the bill for the repair, and they eventually wrote me a check. I still think Nissan should 'man-up' and begin a maintenance program (aka recall) and fix this problem.

Martyf250 04-26-2012 06:21 AM

I just dropped mine off at dealer this morning to have the timing chain shoes done. $1200 bucks. I made my case with Nissan corporate but only got $250 debit card for my troubles. Anything less than full compensation is not enough if you ask me. I'll probably send them a copy of my bill once it's done to make a statement.

superbawn 05-07-2012 09:54 AM

Hey guys I posted on this site a couple years back and I was just curious if Nissan had changed their tune about this timing chain problem, or updated the design at all, but it looks like they are still telling people to pound sand just like they told me. I had an 05 Pathfinder and I had plenty of issues, here are some things to be aware of...timing chain tensioners ($1700 at dealer), front roof rack covers flying off (I think this design was updated in 2006), fuel gauge sender, Variable Air Intake System (VIAS) butterfly valve assembly rattling at 2200RPM (fixed myself), rear suspension camber bolts seized so no alignment could be performed, had to get both lower control arms replaced (quoted $1500 at dealer, had another shop fix for $1200), basically all the heat shields had to be clamped on or bent away from the exhaust to stop the rattleing, bypassed the radiator tranny cooler because I was scared of the intermixing issues with faulty radiators I read about, EVAP canister plugged with dust (quoted $600 at dealer), tires always cupped and chopped from day one no matter if you rotated every 5k miles..the last straw for me was when it started knocking it in cold weather when I'd start it up..in my mind it had something to do with all the metal filings from the timing chain mixing into the oil that then circulated throughout the engine. All I know is that I was embarrased to drive out of the neighborhood until it was warm. Nissan's excuse for the timing chain and the knocking was that I must never change my oil, little did they know that just because I didn't bring it to them I ran full synthetic Mobil 1 and changed the oil every 3000-3500 miles from about 15k miles up until I had that issue, maybe thats why PLASTIC shoes that rub on a METAL chain lasted a little longer than some others...I don't know. Anyway, just wanted to toss my .02 in and say I feel your pain and to be aware of some of the things I had to deal with.

atcc 05-23-2012 10:04 PM

does anyone know what the repair book time is to replace the 2 secondary chains and shoes?

smj999smj 06-04-2012 02:15 AM

The TSB gives a time of 4.6 hours; I'm assuming this is a warranty time. ALLDATA shows a time of 8.9 hours to replace the timing chains plus another 0.4 hours to replace the guides.

When I purchased my 2006 LE, it had 84000 miles on it and I assumed by the Nissan red RTV silicone around the cover that the updated tensioners had been installed, which they were. At 98000 miles, I was driving when all of the sudden the timing chain started rattling badly. I'm assuming whoever did the job overtightened the bolts to the primary timing chain tensioner because one of them broke, causing the primary chain tensioner to pivot and the slack guide to fall back against the inside of the case. Fortunately, the chain didn't jump, but it did damage the primary tensioner and scored up the primary chain upper and slack guides and secondary chain tensioner shoes. I ended up installing a new set of upper tensioner shoes, secondary chains, primary tensioner and two of the primary chain's guides. Made sure I used a torque wrench on everything! Don't want to be doing that job again! Replaced the spark plugs and radiator while I was in there.

atcc 06-04-2012 03:35 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by smj999smj (Post 79175)
The TSB gives a time of 4.6 hours; I'm assuming this is a warranty time. ALLDATA shows a time of 8.9 hours to replace the timing chains plus another 0.4 hours to replace the guides.

When I purchased my 2006 LE, it had 84000 miles on it and I assumed by the Nissan red RTV silicone around the cover that the updated tensioners had been installed, which they were. At 98000 miles, I was driving when all of the sudden the timing chain started rattling badly. I'm assuming whoever did the job overtightened the bolts to the primary timing chain tensioner because one of them broke, causing the primary chain tensioner to pivot and the slack guide to fall back against the inside of the case. Fortunately, the chain didn't jump, but it did damage the primary tensioner and scored up the primary chain upper and slack guides and secondary chain tensioner shoes. I ended up installing a new set of upper tensioner shoes, secondary chains, primary tensioner and two of the primary chain's guides. Made sure I used a torque wrench on everything! Don't want to be doing that job again! Replaced the spark plugs and radiator while I was in there.

Thanks, I ended up doing it already. It took about 7 hrs but I took my time. I think the hardest part was separating the front timing cover( dowels being sticky) to the block, otherwise pretty straightforward, just time consuming. Here's a pic of the $7 part thats causing everyone headaches.

SherylF1 10-11-2012 06:46 AM

My 2007 Nissan was just diagnosed with the same problem. It has 49000 miles and is 3 weeks past the warranty period. I have spent a lot of time trying to convince Nissan to pay for the $1600 repair (calling cutomer service and the warranty department), but they keep telling me "if you had brought your vehicle to the dealer for servicing, they may have been able to determine the problem before the warranty ran out". I called Bullsh** on that one -- no where in the warranty does it say that you are required to get your vehicle serviced at the dealer AND there is a service bulletin out 2005-2007 timing chains in Xterras, so they KNEW there was a problem, and they don't even bother to notify the customers of a mechanical defect in their product. What lousy customer service - I certainly will NOT buy another Nissan. I guess once they get you out the door, they don't care if your vehicle lasts more than 50k or if you buy another one.

smj999smj 10-11-2012 09:14 PM

I'm mentioned this elsewhere, I'm pretty sure, but for those who don't know: it's not the plastic tensioner "feet" that are the problem with the design. It's actually the links of the secondary timing chains that have sharp edges which are cutting into those plastic tensioner "feet." Nissan has updated the chains with rounder edges on the links to prevent this issue from re-occuring...we hope!

ColoradoDave 10-22-2012 02:05 PM

2005 Pathfinder Off Road SE. 103,000. Started ticking about 5k ago. I thought it was a stuck lifter valve but 2 independent mechanics say they know that sound anywhere and that it's the dreaded timing chain issue. Neither wanted to touch the job so I took it to the dealer. After both independents quoted around $1600 the dealer called me and told me that it would be around $2600 because he wanted to change the oil pump and sprockets as well. Did I mention he came up with this before he even opened the engine up? I'm calling bshit and so I called Nissan. Still pending as to whether I will get help on this. If I don't get it fixed for free then Nissan can forget me or dozens of people I know as future customers. Unethical bastards.

mdawg4x4 10-22-2012 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColoradoDave (Post 83598)
2005 Pathfinder Off Road SE. 103,000. Started ticking about 5k ago. I thought it was a stuck lifter valve but 2 independent mechanics say they know that sound anywhere and that it's the dreaded timing chain issue. Neither wanted to touch the job so I took it to the dealer. After both independents quoted around $1600 the dealer called me and told me that it would be around $2600 because he wanted to change the oil pump and sprockets as well. Did I mention he came up with this before he even opened the engine up? I'm calling bshit and so I called Nissan. Still pending as to whether I will get help on this. If I don't get it fixed for free then Nissan can forget me or dozens of people I know as future customers. Unethical bastards.

Good luck. I spent $1800 out of my own pocket at 72K miles to have mine changed.

dryart 10-22-2012 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColoradoDave (Post 83598)
2005 Pathfinder Off Road SE. 103,000. Started ticking about 5k ago. I thought it was a stuck lifter valve but 2 independent mechanics say they know that sound anywhere and that it's the dreaded timing chain issue. Neither wanted to touch the job so I took it to the dealer. After both independents quoted around $1600 the dealer called me and told me that it would be around $2600 because he wanted to change the oil pump and sprockets as well. Did I mention he came up with this before he even opened the engine up? I'm calling bshit and so I called Nissan. Still pending as to whether I will get help on this. If I don't get it fixed for free then Nissan can forget me or dozens of people I know as future customers. Unethical bastards.

indeed..........
most dealers want to do no more than maintenance items/fluid changes, and tires
just about anything beyond that is not as profitable, so you'll get a quote that will either be profitable for them should you authorize it, or chase you off as a customer so that you'll take it somewhere else

mdawg4x4 10-24-2012 04:13 AM

The idea is to replace possible items while they are accessible. It will be cheaper to do it then, than if they have to go back in and do it later. Yes they make more money, but they will make even more if you have to go back and replace those items later.

In the end, it's your choice as to what all they do.
Get a quote for just the main repair and make your decision based on the additional cost.

ColoradoDave 10-24-2012 04:19 AM

I understand what you mean but if they're already in there, should it then cost $1000 more for an oil pump and sprockets? Seems like a lot for changing out those items when they are more easily accessible.


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